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crashland73
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   Posted 1/8/2006 10:43 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I have a 1982 XT 200 enduro. Here is some information on it before I start complaining.
Compression; 130-140
New CDI unit
New Coil
New petcock
No battery
New plug (tried 2)
Approx 2300 miles original
New carb boot
carb completely spotless and cleaned
Now, I have done all that I know, which isnt much. I have had it running but it ran bad, like it would rap out but then crap out and run real bad. Hard to start. All gaskets are in superb condition. I really have no clue what is going on. It tries to start, like a few blubs or idles for a few seconds and as soon as I give it throttle it dies. I have the needles set to speck or as close as I can anyway. I really need help real bad thanks for all or any.
Eugene from Arkansasmad

Post Edited (crashland73) : 1/9/2006 5:52:27 AM GMT


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Richard47
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   Posted 1/9/2006 2:23 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
How old is the fuel and is there a spark?


Toilet Brush Dog Owner

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Mac_Muz
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   Posted 1/9/2006 8:49 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Is this a 2 stroke?

Since it sputters some and you have compression it is either faulty spark, or more likely crud in the carb.

Is it possible to drop the float bowl with the carb in place on the engine? If so dropping that off, with care to not damage or drop a part (like put a large dead bed sheet on the ground). I am betting you have lots of crud clogging the internal passageways inside the carb.

Fresh fuel (and 2 stroke oil IF it is a 2 stroke) might help, but not if the crud is excessive.

And where in Ar? anywhere near Franklin? Mac


I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

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AllWXRider
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   Posted 1/9/2006 10:45 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Did you clean out the gas tank? Sounds like lack of fuel. Enough to idle but ask for more and no more. Crud from the gas tank?

FYI never fuel up anything when you see the tanker unloading at the service station. Incoming gas swirls crud off the gas station tank botton for hours.

Doesn't sound like valves since the compression is OK but don't forget to adjust valve tappet clearance.
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AllWXRider
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   Posted 1/9/2006 10:51 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
New petcock!...is it turned on? The newer petcocks need engine vacuum before they open up. Vacuum hose hooked up?

Is the carb boot fitting real well? Any vacuum leaks would spell a lean mixture.
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CaddmannQ
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   Posted 1/9/2006 11:41 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Also, check the gas cap vent. If air can't get in, fuel can't get out. When it starts to sputter out, loosten the cap & see if it picks up speed again.


Cadd
2004 Nomad 1500 "Baggins"
VROC #11619 Rolling Blunder #128

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ianisme
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   Posted 1/11/2006 1:12 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
No battery? Most CDI units require a battery to be fitted in order to work properly.

Mac, its a 4 stroke.


Who needs the video?

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Toolmaan78
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   Posted 1/11/2006 1:30 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I have a 1981 yamaha xt250 And you HAVE to have a fully charged battery or it will be VERY hard to start.
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crashland73
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   Posted 1/17/2006 4:56 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
The fuel is fresh and a good spark. Or it was. I havent checked that recently. Clean carb, this is a 4 stroke, clean tank, non vacume petcock, new boot between carb and head, and as far as I can tell it is fitting tightly, tried the vent thing, wasnt it, and so far no battery. But.... I have had it running without it. Many times. But now nothing. It has never ran real good and never idles for more than about 30 seconds on startup and then it wont idle at all.
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Mac_Muz
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   Posted 1/17/2006 5:31 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I take it this bike has a magneto, which does not require a battery, but a battery helps.. Wait CDI, and no battery? How odd.. anyway

IF there is good spark, and the timing for the spark is correct, then it seems to be fuel related, or lack thereof.

What I might do is check spark, and check static timing for it, so you know you are in the ball park. Then pull the fuel line off the carb to be sure fuel flows. Also make sure the fuel line fits snug to the fitting on the top and at the bottom ends... I have seen fuel lines suck air before.

Reassemble and read the sticky for vacuum leaks and try some of the suggestions there to see if WD-40 will flood it, or run it.


I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

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AllWXRider
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   Posted 1/17/2006 8:24 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Sure sounds like fuel. If you run it again after the engine dies, immediately open the carb drain screw, does fuel come out? 30 seconds of fuel could be just the gas in the carb bowl.

When you re-assembled the carb, was the float and float valve replaced properly?
The float pushes up on the valve to shut off the fuel. If the valve was upside down or damaged, it might allow fuel to flow into the carb bowl very s-l-o-w-l-y.

If you have a squirt can you could try getting it running and squirt gas to keep it running. It this test works, then it's time to take the carb apart again. If its a Mikuni try their website or Hayne or Clymer manual for a pictoral break down. Also www.bikebandit.com has exploded diagrams.

If the exhaust baffle was really plugged, that might shut you down too.

-All WX
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ianisme
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   Posted 1/17/2006 9:10 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
While it may well be fuel related, I would at least hook up some kind of temporary battery to discount it as a cause.


The AT-AT gets so excited on these days out.

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Mac_Muz
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   Posted 1/18/2006 9:45 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
ianisme, I am lost on this one.. What kind of ignition is this with a CDI and no battery? Mac


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ianisme
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   Posted 1/18/2006 11:22 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Beats me Mac. I had an XT350 and that had a CDI setup. I'm pretty sure it wasn't possible to run it without a battery, though maybe the XT200 is different.


The AT-AT gets so excited on these days out.

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crashland73
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   Posted 1/18/2006 9:01 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I have ran it without the battery as with other bikes that I have had. Magneeto (spelling) and cdi. No points. 6v system. As far as I can tell, fuel isnt the problem, but, I will definatly look again. Anymore it wont do nothing but hit and miss now. Not even idle. I know this sounds stupid but I am wondering if the pickup or something is messed up. It appears to have been changed. By that I mean I see wire splices with little blue conectors. I wonder if I need to solder them instead of those conectors?


Jesus IS Lord!

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Mac_Muz
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   Posted 1/19/2006 9:17 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Ya got me.... I have seen magnetos, and they only need a on off switch, a set of poits/condenser, and fly wheel mounted magnet to pass a coil. How a CDI can do this with no battery is a mystery to me...

I have seen that very set up (points and Magneto) with and with out batteries. The one with batteries had charging systems for lighting better. Systems with out a battery AND that also had lighting , the lighting was dim at idle and bright at speeds...

Weak spark might be a problem, but most of these symtoms seem fuel related.


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ianisme
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   Posted 1/19/2006 10:34 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Why are you so reluctant to put a battery in it?


The AT-AT gets so excited on these days out.

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AllWXRider
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   Posted 1/19/2006 10:45 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Those little blue "butt splices" were my #1 problem when I was in industrial process controls. Rain, moisture, corrosion, fat and ugly. At my last company, even the lug and ring crimp-on were critical, so we started a mandatory crimp - then solder each connection.

Solder and heat shrink tubing can't be beat for a good connection. Even electrical tape will unwind with temp changes. Dirt bikes need water proof connections.

I don't know but I'll bet that the kick start is just enough energy on the magneto for the CDI to work. A CDI (Capacitive Discharge Ignition) runs at a much higher voltage than a points system, so it wouldn't take much to make it fire.

Crashland73, your symptoms still sound like fuel. I would disassemble the carb again, the clog is getting worse.

-All WX Rider
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Mac_Muz
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   Posted 1/19/2006 3:46 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
82' was an early day for this type of ignition as well.. I have been thinking about it, and still wonder, but I think there is a magneto that bleeds off power something like 12 volts dc to the coil which must be inside the CDI.

The pick up coil is probably like a early hall effect generator with no power other than what it makes on its own, and only enough to trigger the interuption in the CDI to fore the coil, and if that in this case.

I agree with ianisme, that if the bike can have a battery items electrical will work far better. Engine on lawn tractor like Briggs and Stratton, Wheel Horse, and the like have engine that run on magnetos, but can have a battery, and they run better with the battery.

Engine like chain saws have no battery, and need higher rpm to get good spark from the CDI magneto they have..

Mostly just thinkin in type as I have no clue on this one..


I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

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crashland73
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   Posted 1/19/2006 5:10 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I am not against having a battery, I just havent gotten to that yet. It should run anyway the way it is. As I said on my other bikes, they did without a glitch. But, this one might be an exception. Once I get it running I will purchase a battery. It is a very small 6v. I will definatly check the fuel thing again. We even went to pulling it behind my 4 wheeler to make it run. Or at least fire once in a while.


Jesus IS Lord!

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Mac_Muz
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   Posted 1/19/2006 6:09 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Ok lets try checking things over guessing as we all have been doing. It appears as no one knows this system, or atleast well.

So check the spark, and tell us what you get right off the wires, and check both. If at all possible check ignition timing provided you have spark. You have comprssion, so spark come next.

If that works out well, most definately check for fuel starting at the tank, then the line and the carb finally.

Try a start, then pull a plug and say if it got wet even.

I happen to be near franklin Ar as well which you didn't respond to. The fact I don't know this bike means almost nothing. dec 12th I didn't know squat about Dodge ingnition and found the van I just bought dead the next day. The seller brought over another ESA unit new. it was bad, but it took me two weeks to prove it.

Where I am the Bob Cat has no power on both right side wheels. I have it figured and apart, waiting for the new parts.. I never worked on a Bob Cat before. In fact everything I ever worked on had a #1 some where, but as a foreign car tech for 20+ years there isn't much that will stop me from figurin out how it should work and go from there.. it may take time but I will figure it out...


I'm out of my mind, but feel free to leave a message.

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crashland73
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   Posted 1/21/2006 7:27 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Where is franklin Ark? I live in NW ark. up by eureka springs. I havent gotten to try the fuel yet. I will though.


Jesus IS Lord!

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steves bikes
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   Posted 1/22/2012 10:22 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
hi i have the same problem with my XT200 i have done what you have done to try and get it to run changed the cdi checked the coils are good and still having problems? i found my spark was irregular.i have changed my ht lead if you haven't check you ht lead might be the problem.
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