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Andy VH
Where is the earth shattering kaboom!?



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   Posted 8/10/2009 8:39 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
You have probably heard someone mention using a "press" or "push" for countersteering. What is it? Or more accurately, what IS NOT press or push? In my 17 years of teaching the MSF program I have seen and heard all sorts of interpretations of the press/push action. But this is all it is. The press/push initiates and controls when, how quickly, and how much a motorcycle leans into a curve or to change direction. So here we go:
 
At any speed more than a walking speed, ALL bicyles and motorcycles lean and turn by countersteering. Meaning, to make the bike lean/turn left, you press/push against the left handlebar grip, to make the bike lean/turn right, you press/push against the right handlebar grip. Simple as that, don't overthink it, just do it and learn from how the bike reacts.
 
But! Its the action of the press/push that seems to confuse many a rider. It is JUST more hand or palm pressure FORWARD against one grip versus the other grip, in the direction you want the bike to go. Simply press/push forward with one hand more than the other and the bike will lean in that direction of the press/push. What the press/push is NOT, is pressing or pushing DOWN on the handlebar grip. Anyone who describes it that way is flat out wrong. It does not matter if you have a cafe-style handlebar or ape-hanger style handlebar, or any handlebar style in between, it is never a press or push down on the handlebar. And this can be proven.
 
If you were riding across a large wide open parking lot, and actually pressed "down" on one handlebar grip, the bike would barely, if at all, change direction. But in the same instance, if you pressed/pushed one grip slightly forward, the bike would instantly respond with leaning. Even sport-bikes, with their racer style riding position, require the rider to press/push slightly forward on the grip in the direction they want. Some sport-bike riders may perceive it as a press/push down, simply because their body position is high over the handlebar. That's because, when riding a sport-bike in the typical non-racing crouch (meaning more upright) their upper body weight is down onto their wrists on the handlebar grips. But when ridden in the racing crouch position, the action is definitely a press/push forward.
 
So, simply put. The "press" or "push" is nothing more than slightly more hand pressure forward against one handlebar grip than the other, in the direction you want the bike to lean/go. Practice it as just that, and learn from how your bike reacts, and you'll gain very accurate control of your bike. How MUCH you press determines how much the bike leans. How QUICKLY you press determines how fast the bike leans in. How LONG you hold the press determines how tight of a radius your are going to follow (or how tight a turn you'll make). WHERE you press in a turn determines the bike's path of travel. WHEN you press, at the beginning of a turn, is a huge factor in determining where the bike ends up at the exit of the turn.   


Training, the best safety and performance "equipment" you can get!
Get MSF trained, check out: http://www.msf-usa.org

Post Edited (Andy VH) : 3/11/2010 5:16:40 AM GMT

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Smitty
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   Posted 8/10/2009 12:02 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
If(?) you have come downhill on a paved road on a bicycle darn fast then for sure you will have automatically used this countersteering without even realizing it. otherwise you would have spilled with the bicycle.



Remember all the others on the road are crazy & out to kill you.

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Andy VH
Where is the earth shattering kaboom!?



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   Posted 8/10/2009 3:11 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Exactly right Smitty. But what people don't realize is the control inputs required to make a bicycle lean into a turn are kind of "intuitive". I mean, watch any little kid first riding a bicycle. Once they get to the point that they can pedal and balance, within a matter of maybe 100' their brain "clicks into" the countersteering mode even though they have had no one tell them how it works. From then on, the old saying "once you know how to ride a bicycle, you never forget" applies.

All great and good for a bicycle, where the rider out-weighs the bike by a factor of 2 to 20 time. The bike rider simply leans the upper body into the turn and the bike quickly responds. Because the bike itself has little impact on the dynamics of the whole rider/bike total. But, apply that same bicycle riding logic to a motorcycle, and things are NOT the same at all. The cycle wieghs MUCH more than the rider, and it requires stronger, more direct control inputs to get it to lean in. Also, the tires/wheels on a cycle are bigger, heavier, spinning MUCH faster (producing a much greater gyroscopic effect), and as such it requires greater effort and more direct control inputs at the handlebar to make the motorcycle lean in as desired.

That, I feel is one of the main reasons cycle riders, with no proper training, get in trouble very easily on a motorcycle. Because they sense the control efforts should be the same or similar to a riding a bicycle, they don't know what to do unless trained when the bike doesn't go, lean or turn like they expect it should. Panic quickly takes over and all control ability is gone.


Training, the best safety and performance "equipment" you can get!
Get MSF trained, check out: http://www.msf-usa.org

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Moedad
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   Posted 8/11/2009 10:55 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Andy VH said...
That, I feel is one of the main reasons cycle riders, with no proper training, get in trouble very easily on a motorcycle. Because they sense the control efforts should be the same or similar to a riding a bicycle, they don't know what to do unless trained when the bike doesn't go, lean or turn like they expect it should.
 
Amen to that. I've logged thousands and thousands and thousands of miles commuting by bicycle and doing century rides, etc., and did some off-road riding on small motorcycles and the countersteering concept was one I thought I understood when I started riding a street bike. Uh-uh. Even while taking the MSF course, it didn't click all the way, maybe because of the lower speeds. Wasn't the MSF's fault, it was MY fault because I thought I knew what I was doing. I passed the course, didn't I? I didn't fall down in the swerve exercizes, or the U-turn exercizes, etc.  I was good to go, or so I thought. It wasn't until I got out on a good twisty road with some room to run that I finally understood what I DIDN'T understand before, and was finally able to feel the control I didn't even know I'd been lacking. And I repeat, it wasn't the fault of the MSF instructors, it was a learning block from all my years of bicycling and to a lesser degree, riding light dirt bikes in the desert where cornering is somewhat different than street riding, depending on the surface (sand, gravel, paked dirt, etc.).

Post Edited (Moedad) : 8/11/2009 5:59:01 PM GMT

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Andy VH
Where is the earth shattering kaboom!?



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   Posted 8/11/2009 6:55 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Thanks Moedad. In the past few years, after 35 years of street riding, I got back into dirt riding. This past June I spent a day dirt riding on loose, sandy tight trails. I felt like I didn't know squat about riding a dirt bike. And my Honda 600 dirt bike felt like a huge heavy pig. That is, until I started to apply and modify my street riding skills to suit the techniques of loose dirt riding, that I found I could rely on what the bike needed from me to make it make the turns.

My point is, even though I have been riding for 37 years, I still needed to adjust and change my riding techniques to suit dirt riding. The same applies when people think bike riding, or dirt bike riding, makes them ready for street riding.


Training, the best safety and performance "equipment" you can get!
Get MSF trained, check out: http://www.msf-usa.org

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Smitty
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   Posted 8/12/2009 11:48 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

If you have seen any of the better flat tracing oval races note how those riders go into the slide to the LEFT in all cases with the handlebars being left side pressed down while right side is pulled back.  Took me a while, my first year, to learn hot to race a bike in that fashion which also rubbed off on road racing, MXing, Enduro, Cross Country Racing to some yrs of Road Racing.

Obviously after a while all seemed normal to me, but sometimes in many events I would have so much power onto the rear wheel that sometimes I would notice it trying to get ahead of the front, so time for some changes right then & there.  If I did not then suddenly the bike & I would part company whith me not Low-Siding but High Siding & the landing was a bit hard on myself to WAS the bike not damaged to much.

Those days of Hot Footing in the dirt, around a berm or corner were touch & go situations.


Remember all the others on the road are crazy & out to kill you.

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DaveinOH
'06 Suzuki SV650



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   Posted 2/28/2010 12:45 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
This is a great explanation, I have a related question. If I am on the highway cruising along at 60 or so and I want to change to the right lane, do I press on the right grip? Is this motion enough to actually make the lane change happen or is there additional steering input needed? For instance, do I press the grip to start the lean and then steer into it? I have not yet had a bike up to speeds high enough that I have experienced counter steering, or at least recognized it. Most of my experience was on back dirt roads on a little dirt bike. I think I may be overthinking counter steering a bit, I'm guessing it becomes second nature after a while.
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skyhawk04kilo
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   Posted 2/28/2010 2:50 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
DaveinOH said...
This is a great explanation, I have a related question. If I am on the highway cruising along at 60 or so and I want to change to the right lane, do I press on the right grip? Is this motion enough to actually make the lane change happen or is there additional steering input needed? For instance, do I press the grip to start the lean and then steer into it? I have not yet had a bike up to speeds high enough that I have experienced counter steering, or at least recognized it. Most of my experience was on back dirt roads on a little dirt bike. I think I may be overthinking counter steering a bit, I'm guessing it becomes second nature after a while.


You won't even think about it. It will just happen.


2001 Suzuki Bandit 1200S
1978 Yamaha XS650 Special

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jocomo
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   Posted 2/28/2010 7:05 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I agree with skyhawk. I believe everybody countersteers whether they know it or not. As far as changing lanes goes, yes, just a slight push on the right handlebar will be enough to get you to the next lane to the right without any further input. When you take that bike out(if you haven't already) just get out on a desolate road and experiment with it. You'll get the point right off the bat.
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DataDan
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   Posted 2/28/2010 7:07 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
DaveinOH said...
If I am on the highway cruising along at 60 or so and I want to change to the right lane, do I press on the right grip? Is this motion enough to actually make the lane change happen or is there additional steering input needed? For instance, do I press the grip to start the lean and then steer into it?
That's exactly what you do, and that's all you have to do. Press on the right bar, and the bike swerves right. Find a vacant 2-lane road in the middle of nowhere and practice using the technique to swerve from lane to lane. When you're doing it right, you can change lanes very quickly.
 
Now, to qualify the "no additional steering input" part. When you swerve hard, an additional input is needed to straighten the bike up so you don't continue swerving into the weeds. Press right to swerve one lane to the right. Then press left to bring the bike back up to vertical and point it straight down the road. The left press is only about half as hard as the initial press right, but it is needed to complete the maneuver safely.
 
Give it a try and tell us how it works for you.


A superior rider uses superior judgment to avoid problems that would demand his superior skill.

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GeoffG
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   Posted 2/28/2010 8:45 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
DaveinOH said...
... If I am on the highway cruising along at 60 or so and I want to change to the right lane, do I press on the right grip? Is this motion enough to actually make the lane change happen or is there additional steering input needed? For instance, do I press the grip to start the lean and then steer into it?

As others have said, yes, you would press the right grip (forward, not down!) and the bike will lean to the right. Other steering input depends on the bike...some bikes want you to continue pressing to keep the bike turning, others don't (this difference is more noticeable on corners than just changing lanes, though).

You don't have to actually steer the bike into a corner once it is leaned--front end geometry does that for you (and this is why different bikes respond differently to countersteering, since different geometry creates different amounts of steering from the lean). Generally speaking, the more lean you want, the more you press. If you press the opposite side (or pull on the same side) the bike will stand up and straighten out.

And yes, this stuff becomes second nature after a while (in fact, a lot of guys do this without even knowing they're doing it...but you can do it better if you're aware of it).
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DaveinOH
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   Posted 3/1/2010 4:57 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Ok, I took a short ride around my neighborhood this afternoon and did some experimenting. You're absolutely right, it's not as weird as I thought it was going to be. I ws careful to pay particular attention to how my bike responded to my movements. At times I found it almost going where I thought it should with what seemed like NO input. Cool feeling, I will be taking more of these little rides around the neighborhood while I wait for my MSF classes to start.
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Easy Rider 2
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   Posted 3/1/2010 6:31 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
DaveinOH said...
At times I found it almost going where I thought it should with what seemed like NO input.
That may be because you were leaning a bit.  It is, after all, the LEAN that really makes the bike turn !!
Think stunters who can do figure 8s without touching the bars.
 
 
 


 
 

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Andy VH
Where is the earth shattering kaboom!?



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   Posted 3/10/2010 10:03 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.

This comment "It is, after all, the LEAN that really makes the bike turn !!" is spot on true. But! The difference is HOW you make the bike lean. That can be done with upper body lean, but no where near as quickly or accurately as with varying handgrip pressure to countersteer. Lean is initiated, and controlled, MOST accurately, with countersteering, period. To initiate lean, or to adjust lean angle and path of travel in a curve, nothing works better or more directly than countersteering.

True too, that a cycle can be ridden and directed without touching the handlebar at all. BUT! And this is a BIG BUT! In order to get a motorcycle to change direction, change lean angle, get VERY accurate positioning while leaned over, you HAVE to be good at countersteering methods. Body lean does work to make a cycle lean. Foot pressure on the footpegs does work to make a cycle lean. Knee pressure against the side of the bike or fuel tank does work. But, NOTHING works as well or as directly as handgrip pressure and countersteering.

This was proved by well known cycle riding expert Keith Code, and his No BullS*#t bike. It had a an extra handlebar mounted directly to the frame instead of the front fork. With that bike he proved the difference in control of handgrip pressure on the regular handlebar versus using the frame mounted handlebar which excluded any opportunity to do any countersteering. The bike could be leaned with the frame mounted handlebar, but the reaction of the bike to rider input was FAR too SLOW for accurate and safe riding.

As to the comment about stunt riders doing figure-8s without touching the grips: in many cases they do that with the front tire up in the air, and the bike's center of rotation is very close to the vertical balance line through the bike. By using footpeg or frame induced pressue that bike can be moved much more quickly. Similar for when the bike is on both tires but the rear tires is spinning fast enough to light it up, because then the rear tire acts like a big gyroscope which gives the bike balance while hardly moving. Again, the rider can make the bike direct itself with footpeg pressure.

But for the rest of us riding bikes with normal handlebars, and keeping both tires on the ground during normal riding conditions, nothing works better or more directly than countersteering input at the grips. This is proven and supported by every riding expert, Ken Condon, Keith Code, David Hough, Tony Foales, Lee Parks, Larry Grodsky, etc, etc, all support countersteering skills as one of THE most critical skills to posses and master.

As I have said before, it is entirely possible to ride a bike without using ACTIVE and PURPOSEFUL countersteering inputs, and simply feel the bike as it responds to the likely unknown inputs we do use, like upper body lean, head lean, footpeg pressure, etc. The big difference though, is those methods are very slow in response, inaccurate for directional positioning, especially at highway speeds. I feel that is one of the MAIN reasons so many riders are involved in crashes reported as "rider lost control in a curve", or "rider failed to negotiate the curve", when more than likely the bike was fully capable of doing it and the curve itself was easy to navigate. This is critical too, because bikes can manuever turns and corners at speeds typically higher than cars, simply because of the leaning aspect. But untrained, poor skilled riders who find it all too easy to crank on the speed in a straight line, find themself in a potentially dangerous situation when the road bends and they claim "the bike wouldn't make the turn!" Oh yes it will!! The rider simply didn't give the bike the correct inputs to make it do it. In most every case, THE RIDER is a full fault.


Training, the best safety and performance "equipment" you can get!
Get MSF trained, check out: http://www.msf-usa.org

Post Edited (Andy VH) : 3/10/2010 5:09:35 PM GMT

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DaveinOH
'06 Suzuki SV650



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   Posted 3/10/2010 6:20 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Andy,

Over the past week I have been riding more and more and practicing. I try to keep in mind counter steering and how the bike reacts at different rates of speed. One issue I have been working on is this: A few times after riding a fairly long stretch at speed, I'll come to an intersection where I will be making a left turn. I start moving, lean into the turn, look where I am going and start to turn. At times it feels as though I am going wide and getting too close to the curb. My thought is that I get accustomed to how quickly the bike reacts to my steering inputs at speed and I'm expecting the same type of reaction when making that left turn at a much slower speed. It has caught me off guard once or twice requiring a quick adjustment! The last time I did it, I caught myself looking at the curb instead of where I needed to go. I think that was a big part of it too. Great explanation Andy, I will be referring back to it often as I learn.

Dave
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Smitty
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   Posted 3/10/2010 7:31 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Friend of mine moved over to Canada right after WWII to purchase his loved AJS 350 only after a year or so his wife was about to have a child & he would have to find work as he was the one to bring in the bread. 
 
What hurt so much was selling his 350. Then I popped up at his photographic shop, in the 60s, with one of my dirt comp irons & we would chat about riding. 
 
Again that sort of hurt him, so in 1980 he was looking at some 'used' bikes, also reading up about this NEW "counter steering thing" only to realize during WWII in London that he how he used his bicycle. 
 
That was his answer & so it became natural to him.  As of last year he had never had an accident in his riding skills!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
 
Lastly he is one of these strange chaps that rides BMW m/c!!!!!!!!!


Remember all the others on the road are crazy & out to kill you.

Post Edited (Smitty) : 3/12/2010 7:56:59 PM GMT

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skyhawk04kilo
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   Posted 3/10/2010 9:37 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
DaveinOH said...
Andy,

Over the past week I have been riding more and more and practicing. I try to keep in mind counter steering and how the bike reacts at different rates of speed. One issue I have been working on is this: A few times after riding a fairly long stretch at speed, I'll come to an intersection where I will be making a left turn. I start moving, lean into the turn, look where I am going and start to turn. At times it feels as though I am going wide and getting too close to the curb. My thought is that I get accustomed to how quickly the bike reacts to my steering inputs at speed and I'm expecting the same type of reaction when making that left turn at a much slower speed. It has caught me off guard once or twice requiring a quick adjustment! The last time I did it, I caught myself looking at the curb instead of where I needed to go. I think that was a big part of it too. Great explanation Andy, I will be referring back to it often as I learn.

Dave


The bike will have a totally different feel when you're moving slowly. It may feel like you're going to topple over if you lean it going slow, but you won't. Don't be afraid to lean more if you think you're running wide. That's the only option you have aside from "straighten up and stop", and that's not something you want to be doing in the middle of an intersection.

The trouble with learning to ride (and learning to fly, for that matter), is that it's very much a "seat of the pants" type of activity. It doesn't matter what your brain thinks about, if the seat of your pants doesn't understand what's going on, you're lost. A lot of guys want to try to understand the theory in an attempt to learn the basics faster, but instead they slow themselves down because they're going by what their brain tells them instead of the seat of their pants.

You need to get to a point where turning and leaning and negotiating intersections at a normal speed is second nature. Once you reach that level, then start playing around a little bit, thinking through the body motions in an attempt to refine the skills. It's all baby steps, and right now you're at the bottom of the staircase. All you need to know right now is to go slow through a turn and you won't overwhelm yourself. It's easy if you let your ass do the thinking instead of your brain!


2001 Suzuki Bandit 1200S
1978 Yamaha XS650 Special

Post Edited (skyhawk04kilo) : 3/11/2010 4:40:37 AM GMT

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Andy VH
Where is the earth shattering kaboom!?



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   Posted 3/10/2010 10:11 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Keep practicing it and especially using the countersteer technique to find out how the bike reacts, and how quickly it reacts. Then you can train your brain to automatically adjust how much you need for a given set of conditions.

Many riders never even get close to realizing how much their bike is capable of, and how much they can do with it. So often I hear a rider say "that turn was really tough to get through" when I know and I know how very easy it is to ride cleanly. Or I hear a rider say "the bike just wouldn't turn". On no, it would, but YOU the rider didn't let it do what it could.

I always tell my MSF students, once they grasp the basics of countersteering, is to not over think it, but practice it and feel the feedback from the bike. That is the easiest way to learn it. My orthopedic surgeon, obviously a very intelligent man, failed my MSF BRC because he simply would NOT accept the concept of countersteering, especially for the swerve manuever. He failed the skills test because of it. I later owrked with him one-on-one and he finally accepted it. But prior to that he was trying to over-think it and he never let his body and brain learn the muscle memory of the actions.

Also, I always coach my students, "LOOK to the the eixt of the turn, and PRESS your way to get there, by pressing on the handgrip in the direction of the turn." Look to where you want the bike to go, not where it is at the moment, and press to get there.


Training, the best safety and performance "equipment" you can get!
Get MSF trained, check out: http://www.msf-usa.org

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Easy Rider 2
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   Posted 3/11/2010 9:37 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
DaveinOH said...
At times it feels as though I am going wide and getting too close to the curb.
This is where you might want to add a little purposeful body lean to the inside for those turns.
 
Running wide in turns is one of the most difficult things for a lot of new riders because your instinct from cars is to slow down......but that is exactly the WRONG thing to do on a bike. 
 
On two wheels, you need to increase your push on the inside bar and/or lean more without letting off the gas.  If you DO let off the gas, that tends to stand you up (less lean) and make you go even straighter (wider).
 
It is a hard concept but you MUST learn it.......or you will be off the bike in the ditch in no time.
 
The same principle applies to a low speed turn but to a much lesser degree.
 
 


 
 

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DaveinOH
'06 Suzuki SV650



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   Posted 3/11/2010 1:00 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Oddly enough it's only an issue at really slow speeds, I do really well at higher speeds and tend to lean just right (with the obligatory cheesy grin on my face!). It's the really low speed turns just starting out that have caught me off guard once or twice. MSF is coming up in a few weeks, I will make sure to pay close attention.
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Andy VH
Where is the earth shattering kaboom!?



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   Posted 3/11/2010 10:24 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Where is your head at slow speeds? By that I mean, where are you looking? A big factor for improved control at all speeds is where the eyes are looking, and even at slow speeds it can make a big difference. If you find yourself looking down maybe ten or twenty feet ahead of the front tire, you're not looking far enough ahead.

Also, even for slow turns, look to where you want the bike to go, not where it is at the moment. At slow speeds, fine control of the throttle, clutch and REAR brake all combine to make a big difference. Motorcycles move the best, even at slow speeds, when given smooth, positive, accurate control inputs. Even starting and turning from a stop take practice and good visual control.

If you are taking the MSf class soon, you'll get lots of practice at slower speeds.


Training, the best safety and performance "equipment" you can get!
Get MSF trained, check out: http://www.msf-usa.org

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jocomo
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   Posted 3/11/2010 11:20 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
Dave, I think most new riders experience that too close to the curb thing at first. I think the problem comes from not trusting the lean. As you gain more experience it will feel natural to stay on the throttle and lean more through the turn. Like Andy says, looking well ahead.
 
 
 
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Well Enuff
--- Regaining my sanity --- one ride at time



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   Posted 3/12/2010 11:02 AM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
jocomo said...
 I think the problem comes from not trusting the lean. 


After countersteering, trusting the lean is the next step. Dave, read Andy's lesson about lean here:

http://forum.motorcycle-usa.com/default.aspx?f=22&m=188202 

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DavidLSI
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   Posted 6/23/2010 4:59 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I found this video a while back and it explains counter-steering clearly why you can not steer a motorcycle without counter-steering


www.youtube.com/watch?v=C848R9xWrjc&mode=related&search=

SeeYa
DavidLSI
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Andy VH
Where is the earth shattering kaboom!?



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   Posted 9/7/2010 5:32 PM (GMT -7)    Quote This PostAlert An Admin About This Post.
I recently observed a new training session for the MSF ARC (Advanced Rider Course) which is a derivative of the Military Sport Bike rider course. During that session I heard someone describe countersteering as pressing down against one handlebar grip more than the other.

At the beginning of this post I said that countersteering is never pressing DOWN against a grip to initiate the lean. Well, I was right and wrong, just as many people can be when they describe countersteering, especially those Youtube "How to ride a motorcycle" experts. Ride a few years, maybe a 1000 miles, buy a helmet-cam and suddenly you too can be a Youtube rider expert! But I digress. The action of applying countersteering input to the bike has to be taken in the context of the bike style and how it is ridden, when you describe how to apply countersteering. Think of the difference in rider position and hands on a HD with tall Apehangers, versus a GSXR sportbike with clip-on style handlebars. For the Ape-hanger style, countersteering is almost like pushing up into the air, whereas a GSXR IS indeed like pushing down on the grips.

So, I still maintain the input of countersteering is never pushing DOWN on the grip, even if it is on a sportbike. I still say the input of countersteering is applying more palm pressure against one handgrip than the other. The palm with more pressure applied against the grip versus the other determines in which direction the bike will lean and go. So when you hear someone describe countersteering as pressing down at least you'll know what they really mean. This can especially confusing for a newbie rider who really doesn't understand the concept, but does feel how the bike reacts. But some riders take "press DOWN on the grip" literally and in so doing it, don't get the bike to react properly and miss out on what is really happening.

Word of caution, watch the all the YouTube "How to ride a motorcycle" so called expert videos with a cynical eye, and HUGE block of salt as the saying goes.


Training, the best safety and performance "equipment" you can get!
Get MSF trained, check out: http://www.msf-usa.org
 

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