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webmaster
Oversight Committee Chairman

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 321

Posted 3/25/2005 12:14 PM (GMT -8)

The first installment of our H-D Sportster Project Bike is live and ready for your viewing pleasure. We've got more work to do on it so let us know if you have any bright ideas OK.

Post Edited (webmaster) : 9/10/2005 2:54:23 PM GMT

ianisme
Typical Bloody Brit!

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 8110

Posted 3/25/2005 1:07 PM (GMT -8)

I would like to know what the eventual outcome is that you plan for this bike? Its presumably nothing to do with improving the performance or handling as all that you have done so far is bolt on more superfluous weight. Is this just some cosmetic exercise?

Much less controversial than the pope.

webmaster
Oversight Committee Chairman

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 321

Posted 3/25/2005 2:31 PM (GMT -8)

Ian - you didn't read paragraph 4, sub-section 2-4? This is just the slow start to a cool project. Motor and more will be addressed in the future installments. For now though – it’s all about the show.

ianisme
Typical Bloody Brit!

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 8110

Posted 3/25/2005 3:49 PM (GMT -8)

Yeah, I read it but I guess we have different ideas about what would make this bike cool. I mean, whats the point of giving it a new engine (presumably more power?) if you then hang a bunch of stuff on it that makes the whole plot heavier? I thought that the idea of the "Sportster" was to be the 'lightweight' in the Hog range?

Now if you told me you were going to junk as much standard stuff as possible and replace it with magnesium this and carbon fibre that, I might have been more impressed. Get the thing down below 400 pounds, then give it a decent engine, brakes, wheels, frame, suspension etc and I could understand it. As it is, it seems like you are just going to produce another tart's handbag of a bike using whatever bolt on crap you can wheedle out of HD.

At the end of the day, the only people who will be impressed are those who like Harleys and other cruisers anyway. And yes, I do think the Sportster is a cruiser and this project bike does not sound like it will be changing my mind at least. I just wish you guys had been more daring and tried to build a bike for folks who like corners and performance. Next year you could always turn an R1 into a sofa for those who felt cheated by turning a Sportster into a sports bike.

Much less controversial than the pope.

Kevin Duke
Rubber-side Down

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 1521

Posted 3/25/2005 6:44 PM (GMT -8)

The thinking behind the modifications made to our project was to reflect the kinds of choices made by the majority of consumers. I think you'll find that most Sportster buyers aren't lusting after carbon fiber. That said, I like your idea...

-KD, MCUSA Road Test Editor

ianisme
Typical Bloody Brit!

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 8110

Posted 3/25/2005 10:39 PM (GMT -8)

I'll have one more go to convince you guys. At least I'm making some suggestions!

How about you turn this cruiser into a modern version of the XLCR Cafe Racer of the late 70's? You know how much interest there is in Harleys on this board, but there is also a lot of interest anytime somebody mentions a new American sportsbike. Sportsbikes generally are increasing in popularity in the US. By taking the easy option of blinging out another cruiser you will be missing out on a golden opportunity to appeal to both sides of the biking world. I know you lot are into sports bikes and I'm sure you could make a fair job of a building a modern American cafe racer for the new millenium.

I know that the majority are happy enough chroming their tyre valves or bolting on Maltese Cross shaped fork springs, but I really think this could be so much more interesting. Who knows; you might even start a welcome trend towards encouraging owners to improve their motorcycle's dynamics rather than just "shop window" reflection appeal.

Much less controversial than the pope.

Tros
Global Moderator

Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 7309

Posted 3/26/2005 1:42 AM (GMT -8)

It's still a shame you guys can't do the motor modifications I told Korf about. Vroom vroom, lol.

I'm old enough to know better; too young to care!
“Never trade the thrills of living for the security of existence."

designeraccd
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 2003
Total Posts : 38

Posted 3/26/2005 3:25 AM (GMT -8)

To each his own....but I'm glad I haven't done that to my 1200R. Instead the trashy Showa "suspension" was replaced front and rear, a Corbin Gunfighter saddle put on for humane seating and the Stage I "tax" for a bit more ooomph. Some brightwork was added: 883 BDA engine covers replaced the dirt absorbing dull gray painted ones. The bike has constantly amazed me: she loves to run (as opposed to the waddling my 3 previous Sporty's did...) thru curves and will comfortably sustain 85-95. Now if only this lousy weather would go away and allow some long range riding! The new Sportster is a significant improvement, functionally, over any previous one. Heck my 1200R can almost match what my '82 Kaw GPZ 550 could do...way back then; progress..Milwaukee "style"....nyuknyuknyuk.....

DFO

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David Rider
2005 ST1300

Date Joined Dec 2004
Total Posts : 546

Posted 4/13/2005 6:36 PM (GMT -8)

If you get the chance I'd really like to see the 4.5 gallon fuel tank put on this model and I noticed that Harley sells an optional upgrade to duel front disks for it too.

There's looks and performance.

TinaB
Registered Member

Date Joined Jun 2005
Total Posts : 3

Posted 6/26/2005 12:11 PM (GMT -8)

Wow. Would've joined in this Sporty forum topic three months ago, but had issues getting the silly Registration for the site to work...

I also purchased a 1200C and would really enjoy reading comparisons for seats, muffler setups (sound, performance, price), shocks and any other upgrades. I've changed out the handlebars on mine and the handling is 100% improved. Although I've also added chrome bolt ons, saddlebags, etc. I may have found the best "upgrade" value so far was one of those little $10 throttle-grip wrist rests...LOL

Keep the articles coming :)

Kevin Duke
Rubber-side Down

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 1521

Posted 6/27/2005 12:24 PM (GMT -8)

We've just added an intake and exhaust to our project. Stay tuned for a report.

-KD, MCUSA Editor

webmaster
Oversight Committee Chairman

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 321

Posted 9/8/2005 4:29 PM (GMT -8)

Finally - the 2005 H-D Sportster Project - Part 2 is here. Check it out and let us know - are we doing good or what?

Tros
Global Moderator

Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 7309

Posted 9/8/2005 4:52 PM (GMT -8)

I wondered how that bike was coming along. So far, so good.

Johnny L
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 836

Posted 9/9/2005 4:19 AM (GMT -8)

I'm currently on an '05 883 and just about ready for my 1k service, which is where most people "pay the tax" with the air cleaner/rejet/pipes and am trying to decide if it's worth it or not.

Kev, I got the bike after reading your and a few other peoples' reviews I trust and so far am really happy with it. My only two complaints are that the carberation is really lean at idle (say for instance at a stoplight) and that it did lack some roll-on power for passing on the interstate. Can you give a little more description on how you thought the roll-on improved?

Also the chrome you put on actually looks pretty tasteful, good job there.

Thanks.

Kevin Duke
Rubber-side Down

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 1521

Posted 9/9/2005 8:11 AM (GMT -8)

Johnny, I actually can't comment on how our breathed-upon motor works since the mods, as I haven't ridden it yet. What I can say is that, although a 5-hp boost doesn't sound like much, it is a significant 10.5% increase in power. Also, the EPA is to blame for your bike's lean spot off idle. I'll have Kenny give you some input on how the revised jetting affected its performance.

-KD, MCUSA Editor

Kenny
MCUSA - Editorial Director

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 460

Posted 9/9/2005 9:24 AM (GMT -8)

Thank you, thank you. A big round of applause please for our man in the trenches... Duke Danger... Ok, that's enough, now have a seat and take a load off - we don't want him getting a swelled head or anything!

Johnny - I will start with the roll-on power. First of all the stock Sporty's 883 Twin just doesn't pull like a big-bore Twin does so were behind the game from the get-go there. What it does do is make power in a very linear fashion so by de-restricting our Project Bike here we have allowed it to accelerate a bit harder. It is definitely a noticeable increase despite the small numbers on the dyno. By making an change like this your bike will run better (so to speak) so long as your dealer gets it dialed in.

As far as the lean jetting goes, Duke is correct - not much you can do there - but I have a suggestion. Now, I don't know if you are aware of this but under your throttle is a small dial/adjuster. Check it out. You can adjust your idle speed there so your bike doesn't lope along at a really low rpm like I suspect is what is concerning you at the stop light.

Kansas - Why don't you give us some performance upgrade suggestions so I cna try to work one in if at all possible. Keep in my the upgrades I want to do on this bike need to be centered around parts available from H-D for now.

Damn it, where'd Duke go now?

Johnny L
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 836

Posted 9/9/2005 9:35 AM (GMT -8)

Kenny, one more quick question if you don't mind.

What was your impression of the change in sound on the pipes? It's hard for me to get much of a bearing on it because the "Harley" folks I know (or at the dealer for that matter) have an entirely different definition of "loud"than we use in the sportbike world. I'd like your thoughts on it since you have ridden plenty of both.

Thanks.

Tros
Global Moderator

Date Joined Apr 2004
Total Posts : 7309

Posted 9/9/2005 4:41 PM (GMT -8)

Kenny said...

Kansas - Why don't you give us some performance upgrade suggestions so I can try to work one in if at all possible. Keep in my the upgrades I want to do on this bike need to be centered around parts available from H-D for now.

Sadly, all of my performance tips for the Sportster are things I've heard you can't do to the motorcycle. My first suggestion was to show people how "simple" a 883 to 1200 conversion would be. Not only is it still cheaper than buying a 1200, but it'll have slightly more hp (compared to a stock 1200).

My second suggestion was for a rip-roaring' Sportster. Basically convert the 883 into the engine from the XB9. That’s right, 92 hp and 70 ft-lb. I can't seem to find my resource on what parts need swapped, but it was a rather simple conversion. I remember that while the 883 can be turned into the XB9's motor people with the 1200 can't get their engines converted over to the XB12's motor due to clearance issues.

I do have a question/suggestion for you guys. Why did you guys use slip-ons when you've got a two-into-one exhaust option through Harley Davidson. They look great on sportsters and will provide more performance to boot. (Can't you tell I'm a fan of two-into-one setups?).

webmaster
Oversight Committee Chairman

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 321

Posted 9/10/2005 6:58 AM (GMT -8)

Johnny - The pipes are not too loud at all. Its a bit louder than stock but not by much.

Kansas - Our plan is to install a 1200 kit later on in the project. That is great news to hear it bumps it past a stock Sporty too because that question was on my mind. The Buell conversion would be tough to pull off though. As far as the slip-ons go, it was just a step in the process. I'm going to try to get the 2-1 set up next.

Glad to hear everyone's into this because it is fun for me and if its interesting to you guys that is the goal.

Racer100
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 14

Posted 9/10/2005 1:18 PM (GMT -8)

I guess I'm a little confused... why buy an 883 Sportster if you know you want more power and are just going to spend money on "performance' items right away? Why not buy a 1200 in the first place? This may be a silly question as I don't really "get" the Harley thing in the first place, but I'd be interested to know the rational anyway...

Johnny L
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 836

Posted 9/12/2005 3:27 AM (GMT -8)

Racer100 said...
why buy an 883 Sportster if you know you want more power and are just going to spend money on "performance' items right away? Why not buy a 1200 in the first place?

Because off the showroom floor an 883 Sportster will generally run you $3-4k less than a 1200 will. And the 883 will let you pick out more of the accessories YOU want instead of what the MoCo thinks you ought to have. Kicking the engine up to 1200 from the stock 883 trim will generally run you between $1-2k which leaves another $1k of chrome money at least before you approach the price of a stock 1200. Also by increasing the displacement yourself, you have a wider range of choices in items such as pistons, cams, jugs, etc. that you wouldn't with a factory stocker.

Racer100
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 14

Posted 9/12/2005 4:05 AM (GMT -8)

Johnny L - Thanks so much for the reply. It's hard to argue with that logic! My education continues....

Kenny
MCUSA - Editorial Director

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 460

Posted 9/12/2005 10:36 AM (GMT -8)

JL: We couldn't have said it any better. Funny thing is, we (MCUSA) only figured that out after we tested the 883 and started coming up with ideas on how to keep it for a long-term project. Once we started mapping out what we coudl do to the 883 it became apparent that the 883-1200 conversion was a great way to go for a number of reasons. Starting with the fact that not everyone even knows what they want in the beginning of their riding career. By buying an 883 they start off with an easy bike to ride and then once they have the bug - they can start dumping money into goodies, pipes, chrome or whatever into it. Near the tail end of their experience the choice to pump up the motor hopefully comes after a year or so of learning the ropes - then, its on. Personally I have had a lot of funon the 883 we have and I cannot wat to toss the big jugs on it. Unfortunately there is still one or two more things we must do prior to that. Oh well... life's rough huh.

Damn it, where'd Duke go now?

1Hawk
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2004
Total Posts : 2013

Posted 9/12/2005 11:32 AM (GMT -8)

webmaster said...
Johnny - The pipes are not too loud at all. Its a bit louder than stock but not by much.

This isn't true at all. Compared to the factory exhaust, the Screamin Eagle/Cycle Shack exhaust is far louder, especially when you get it up in the rpm range. Then, after you have had the pipes on for a while, say 2-3 thousand miles, they will be even louder yet and trust me, here in SoCal they are loud enough to get a ticket in places like Hollywood, Huntington Beach, Laguna Beach and what's this, Riverside???? Yup, Riverside too. If you stay out of the throttle they sound much better than the factory pipes (far more deep throated) but saying they are a "bit louder" than the factory units is simply wrong. I think their test meter must have had a glitch the day they tested the difference in dbA or maybe they had ear plugs in......

Hawk

Post Edited (1Hawk) : 9/12/2005 7:38:36 PM GMT

SilverDragon
yes, it's a dragon

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 2571

Posted 9/12/2005 11:37 AM (GMT -8)

hey 1squawk :

i have those pipes

FYI - db level and frequency range are two differnt things (both contribute to 'loudness perception')

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