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Harley1
Forum Moderator

Date Joined Dec 2006
Total Posts : 247

Posted 2/26/2007 9:17 AM (GMT -8)

Neale Bayly got an invite to test the latest marvel in Italian engineering aboard the 2007 Bimota Tesi 2D. We'd like to hear your views about the bike's innovative front swingarm and hub-center steering here in the MCUSA Forum.

Post Edited (Harley1) : 2/26/2007 5:21:55 PM GMT

GeoffG
Harley Ninja!

Date Joined Jun 2003
Total Posts : 9196

Posted 2/26/2007 10:21 AM (GMT -8)

Wow, I love that bike! I'd take one in a second. And I agree with Bayly, when you're riding a bike with a bit less horsepower, you can concentrate more on what the bike is doing and not worry about overdoing the throttle--the ride will be just as exciting.

Any chance of a comparison with the Vyrus 985 C3 4V? (not that I'm actually serious about purchasing either of these...)

Post Edited (GeoffG) : 2/26/2007 6:24:30 PM GMT

Green9R
PWTPT

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 577

Posted 2/26/2007 10:33 AM (GMT -8)

I like this one better..

An on ramp is a terrible thing to waste...

Desmolicious
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2004
Total Posts : 4618

Posted 2/26/2007 10:47 AM (GMT -8)

Yamaha briefly had a hub center steering bike in the early 90s, the GTs1000?. Cool thing was that that bike had similar technology at a price affordable to more peeps. Never caught on though. I've seen these new Bimotas in Bev Hills Ducati and the most striking aspect about them is that nothing else out there in the bike world looks so finely crafted. Really a piece of rollinhg motorcycling art. But... this thing IMO makes the upcoming (whenever it's actually going to happen who knows as my brother has a deposit on one in Bend, OR but the dealer can't give any date) Ducati Desmocideci GP replica seem like a screaming deal for the same money...

Børk! Børk! Børk!

louemc
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 15451

Posted 2/26/2007 11:06 AM (GMT -8)

As far as ArtWork goes, I'm with Green9R, on this, the model he posted looks finer. Makes the Tesi 2D look like a prototype.
As far as Bayly's write up goes, Good lord what journo flower.
Here's another possibility, instead of less power leaving your mind free to concentrate on the other items (seems he even could let his mind wander to the scenic granite mountain range), how about more power and concentrating on the track as well, Ya want exciting? That's more exciting.

Focus the forces, Be The Force

SenorX
Registered Member

Date Joined Feb 2007
Total Posts : 7

Posted 2/26/2007 11:58 AM (GMT -8)

What's the lotto jackpot these days?

YellowDuck
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 4130

Posted 2/26/2007 1:55 PM (GMT -8)

*Yawn* Another alternative suspension design. Actually, the same one Bimota has had for about ten years, no?

Who cares? Anyone notice that telescopic forks actually work pretty well these days?

When a MotoGP team decides that this type of suspension is "better" in some way, then I might be interested.

I like Bimota (DB5, anyone?), but this stuff is just wonky.

Cynicism is what passes for insight among the mediocre - Joe Klein

Kenny
MCUSA - Editorial Director

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 460

Posted 2/26/2007 2:49 PM (GMT -8)

Lou - That version with more power is called the Vyrus. It uses a water-cooled Ducati motor. Hopefully we will get a shot at that version someday too.

Ducky poo - Wake up on the wrong side of the nest this morning? This test is not meant to sell you n buying one of these bikes, instead it is meant to show a side of the industry/technology that many of us will never get to experience. And according to many of the recent tests I have seen this suspension works well enough, in fact the anti-dive properties of the BMW Duolever front end works great. I think these units are just too heavy for racing purposes at this point. Maybe its too complicated to sort out, who knows. I wouldn't be so quick to dismiss it though. Think what would have become of your beloved Ducs if the alternative Desmo drive valve system was dismissed for being wonky back in the beginning. What if Ben didnt fly his kite in the thunderstorm... or worse yet, what if K-Fed never dumped Brit? Where we would all be then?

Damn it, where'd Duke go now?

Post Edited (Kenny) : 2/26/2007 11:09:08 PM GMT

louemc
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 15451

Posted 2/26/2007 3:02 PM (GMT -8)

Kenny said...
Lou - That version with more power is called the Vyrus. It uses a water-cooled Ducati motor. Hopefully we will get a shot at that version someday too.

I'd hope you would get a chance to give it a work out on a track. For your sake, for your impressions.

Focus the forces, Be The Force

ferrix
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2006
Total Posts : 11

Posted 2/26/2007 4:06 PM (GMT -8)

So there seem to be at least two models - the one in the article, and the more covered one shown higher up in this thread... personally I prefer the completely naked one. With a bike like this, you might as well go all the way and be completely outrageous. I'm just wondering which one is the final production version? (or are they going to sell both versions?)

Kenny
MCUSA - Editorial Director

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 460

Posted 2/26/2007 4:40 PM (GMT -8)

Ferrix - the 3D pictured in this thread is quite a bit different. Check the front and rear swingarm components. The 2D in our test is aluminum pieces and the 3D is tubular steel. Certainly similar dimensions (Dont quote me) but different architecture.

Damn it, where'd Duke go now?

YellowDuck
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 4130

Posted 2/26/2007 6:37 PM (GMT -8)

Hey Kenny, don't take it personal. Not dissin' the article. I just don't understand why Bimota bothers with this setup. They have been at it a long time now, and it is just weirdness. Expensive weirdness at that.

As for desmo valves, I don't actually think much of them, honestly. They probably mattered back when they were invented, and valves were heavy and valve springs weak, but these days they are pretty much an anachronism. Nothing at all to do with why I like Ducatis. I'll bet you could make a better Ducati with valve springs. Maybe without all those rockers and crap, they could figure out how to get four valves in an aircooled cylinder, like the Japanese did some time in the 70s.

And yes, I am a tad grumpy today. Sorry.

Cynicism is what passes for insight among the mediocre - Joe Klein

GeoffG
Harley Ninja!

Date Joined Jun 2003
Total Posts : 9196

Posted 2/27/2007 8:19 AM (GMT -8)

YellowDuck said...
I just don't understand why Bimota bothers with this setup. They have been at it a long time now, and it is just weirdness. Expensive weirdness at that.

Well, the guys at Bimota must think it works, or they wouldn't be making these bikes (although I have no idea how many they actually sell...). Weird, yes. Cool too, IMO. And from what I've read (including the above article), hub-center steering seems to work well.

It's true, though, that the Yamaha GTS1000 never sold well. Well, the fact is, the buying public is generally very conservative, and new ideas are hard to sell (which is, I believe, why the Big Four makers, for all they're changing models every couple of years, seldom introduce anything truly new--they leave that to the little guys like Buell, KTM, and yes, Bimota).

louemc
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 15451

Posted 2/27/2007 11:34 AM (GMT -8)

My guess on the Yamaha tanking (somehow tank sounds so right here) was because of the whole package at that time, and, trying to sell it to a touring market. It had Chain drive, didn't it? It had computer/electronics that said, this thing goes south, outside the city limits, and you're screwed because no one outside the city limits is trained, has no reason to be trained, and has no parts needed either.
If the only thing was the hub steering, and all the pluses of that, on a heavy-er, than race bike, it could/should of been a success, instead of just sucking.

Focus the forces, Be The Force

Desmolicious
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2004
Total Posts : 4618

Posted 2/27/2007 1:58 PM (GMT -8)

Kenny said...

or worse yet, what if K-Fed never dumped Brit? Where we would all be then?

I'd still have her poster on my wall...

Børk! Børk! Børk!

Superlight
Registered Member

Date Joined Dec 2004
Total Posts : 113

Posted 2/27/2007 3:02 PM (GMT -8)

For a lot of the reasons stated in this thread, we need companies like Bimota. When they are at their best they push the engineering/design envelope. Interestingly, even for this unaffordable Tesi, the price is way less than any exotic car, so if you really wanted one, most folks could find a way. For a Porsche GT, Ferrari F430, Lambo Galardo, etc, NFW for all but movie stars, rappers and pro athletes.

Desmolicious
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2004
Total Posts : 4618

Posted 2/27/2007 3:51 PM (GMT -8)

There are a bunch of Lambos, Ferraris, Porsche GTs in my neighbourhood, but I've never seen a Bimota on the street. So for way less $$ you can be far more unique. Or for the same $$ as the Bimota you can buy a slightly used Unimog as my brother just did and watch Ferrari owners' jaws drop as girls ignore their cars and check out the truck!

Børk! Børk! Børk!

Charles Wilson
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2007
Total Posts : 1

Posted 3/2/2007 4:14 PM (GMT -8)

OK, OK, the first order of bidness:

Let's get serious about a comparison test.

Tesi 3d against the Norton NRV-588.

Shouldn't be too hard to set up...

Charles

Kevin Duke
Rubber-side Down

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 1521

Posted 3/3/2007 2:15 PM (GMT -8)

Yeah, I'll just call up my buddy George Barber and set up a weekend at his ranch...

-KD, MotorcycleUSA Editor

Wixxy
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2005
Total Posts : 969

Posted 3/3/2007 4:09 PM (GMT -8)

I realize it's all about personal taste, but the front end looks unfinished. Kinda looks like my buddy's Gixxer after he destroyed the fairing. The headlight remained intact, so he rode around like that until the new fairings came in.

The version Green9R posted just looks more complete.

Just one guy's opinion

'99 Ducati 750 SS (half converted to full)

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Instructor for Accident Scene Management, Inc., an organization dedicated to teaching emergency first aid and other safety measures to motorcyclists. Ask me about it!

Richard47
Registered Member

Date Joined Sep 2004
Total Posts : 3953

Posted 3/9/2007 10:40 AM (GMT -8)

For my money, no one has ever demonstrated that hub centre steering is so much better than tele forks that it justifies the extra complexity and expense. It has been tried on racing and road bikes since the sixties and earlier. If it was any better you may be sure that it would be used on race bikes. Tele forks are one of those things that have theoretical disadvantages but work well in practice.

Toilet Brush Dog Owner

Kevin Duke
Rubber-side Down

Date Joined Apr 2003
Total Posts : 1521

Posted 3/9/2007 11:02 AM (GMT -8)

I completely agree, Richard47. But I also applaud the cojones it takes to try to improve upon established design. Just because something works really well doesn't mean there can't be a better way to do it. The industry needs people who are willing to think outside the normal motorcycle paradigm.

-KD, MotorcycleUSA Editor

Desmolicious
Registered Member

Date Joined Aug 2004
Total Posts : 4618

Posted 3/9/2007 1:36 PM (GMT -8)

i dig em paras too!

Børk! Børk! Børk!

flickmeister
Registered Member

Date Joined May 2004
Total Posts : 1021

Posted 8/31/2007 7:40 PM (GMT -8)

louemc said...

Here's another possibility, instead of less power leaving your mind free to concentrate on the other items (seems he even could let his mind wander to the scenic granite mountain range), how about more power and concentrating on the track as well, Ya want exciting? That's more exciting.

Lou,

Look at it this way: a lesser power motor makes you increase your entrance speed or you lose. So bikes like this will make us up our corner entrance speed so the result is "fast in, yawn out." Now that you've accomplished that, when you get on a bike with a real motor, it's "fast in, yee-ha! out." Whaddaya thunk?? Sounds like a plan to me.

louemc
Registered Member

Date Joined Mar 2003
Total Posts : 15451

Posted 9/1/2007 12:44 PM (GMT -8)

Umm, Less power? Let me think about that. I overwhelmingly totally am in favor of little bike domineering to get that (and of course in the company of other little bikes) but, lesser power as a handicap in competition with those other guys...... violates my basic instinct to kick some ass if at all possible

Focus the forces, Be The Force

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